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 The Jill Baker: fellow newb quest
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CavemanJoe
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 12:36 AM UTC (Read 15945 times)  
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Okay, yeah, this one's a stinker. Can't win 'em all.

Would it suck less if Jill didn't join you as a companion?

Other ideas for making this suck less?

EDIT: Some background. The player will initially come across this quest on their first DK, just after they hit level two. Jill will be lv1, with ten hitpoints and atk and def values of .5 of your own (now raised to .8). Healing her is now free, and happens automatically between fights. I can stick in some text where she asks you to take it easy, look for easy fights, take it slow, that sort of thing - and I can give her a readout of how much Req she's gotten, and probably reduce that value too.

However, the question we really want to be asking ourselves is... well, is it still gonna suck?


 
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Matthew
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 12:50 AM UTC  
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I didn't think it was that bad, even though some of the details that 'you' reveal about 'yourself' could contradict what you've already established for the character, or will establish. Having your character say they aren't ex-military is interesting when many characters on the Island are.

And I think having her join you as a short-term companion lends weight to the whole thing, though having req rewards split in half is kind of obnoxious. And isn't the hospital bill to heal Jill kinda expensive? It was for me, anyway.


 
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Hairy Mary
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 12:55 AM UTC  
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I don't see what the problem is, this is for new players is it not? As an old hand it's nothing special, but then it's a nice introductory thing I would say. We've been on this Island far too long, it's quite hard to remember just what it's like as a new comer. Having someone help you in the jungle is probably a nice little bonus. On the other hand, is it possible for Jill to use her own req to heal up? Seeing as how she's taking half of it and all. I don't know quite how that works, seeing as how I'm going in as a veteran robot, and the whole thing's set up for rookies.


 
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Ashtu
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 12:56 AM UTC  
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Yeah, I enjoyed Jill, CMJ - no, she's not The Stranger, but so what? I enjoyed having her follow me around, and testing what her limits were.


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Nanobug
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 01:07 AM UTC  
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I was happy to have her join me, we fought a couple of battles and I thought she was doing ok, but then turned around and she's lying messily all over the jungle floor (lucky it seeps up blood without any permanent stains), me shouting "Medic" and her taken off to the Failboat. It all was over so fast, from her arriving to being taken away with a gash on her head was all of 60 seconds.

Probably cause I was focusing on that new battle timing thing where you have to count the seconds in your head and try to attack at the right time, I wasn't reading the text properly, and didn't see her getting slashed up. Haven't quite got used to it, feels like I'm rushing all the time. As long as its just a bonus if you get the timing close, and not a penalty if the timing is off, I guess its ok, I can try to ignore it. Although its a bit like the old "try NOT to think of a pink pachyderm" mind trick, where its impossible cause its just been stuck in your head.


 
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hajen
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 01:50 AM UTC  
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at first i thought it was working out to be the back story of one of the mercs in IC, but then i stopped in and saw that her name was Crazy Jane, so not.

the dialogue was nice; the combat turned into a game of make sure she doesn't die. i'm glad she only stuck around for a short while... but then again, it's been a long time since i was a rook; i can imagine how it might be interesting and possibly useful to new player.

and it does set up a later meeting, when we can see what her blacksmith muscles have done in the interim.


"tis better to be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt"
 
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Iriana
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 02:11 AM UTC  
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...Aww, she's dead!

I don't know, I actually kind of liked it. From a story standpoint, it was nice to meet a normal person (let's face it, the rest of us are weird folks). Useless as she probably would have been as a fighting companion, I would have liked her to stick around for a bit more. Too bad she died during the first Easy fight I attempted.


 
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2xA-Ron
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 02:14 AM UTC  
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I enjoyed it. I was paying attention to her health and doing my best to keep her alive. I overestimated my own abilities and that's what got her Failboated for me. I would like to see her again. As an intro/helpful RP device, I liked it.


 
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Kallio
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 02:16 AM UTC  
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I actually enjoyed it immensely... right up until the bit where she got KO'd, which I mostly didn't like because I didn't see it coming at all.
I mean, at first I was worried about her, because she had only half my Hitpoints, but then I saw that she healed automatically between fights, and there was no button saying something like "Protect Jill" or "Fight Defensively" or something. What that meant was that there was nothing I could do to change my character's behavior to protect her, and nothing I could do to change her behavior to protect her, and because of that I assumed that the quest was engineered to have only a single ending where Jill survives and everything is hunky-dory.
Then she took massive damage from a monster twice as strong as her and got dragged off to the failboat and I was like "Wait, what?"
I mean, there is a good ending, right? It's not that there's just one ending and it's the bad one?
Assuming there is a good ending, there really needs to be some way to protect Jill from harm. Because as it is, I felt like I got the bad ending from a twist of fate rather than from making bad choices, and that's never fun. I actually got myself knocked out on purpose to see if there was an additional piece of the quest which triggered on the FailBoat, because it just didn't feel like it was over. I felt like since she got hurt -- possibly killed -- and there was nothing I could have done to stop it, there had to be something more to the story, something I could do to make it all be okay after all.
Basically, as long as there's a bad ending, there needs to be some way to make the player feel like it's actually their fault if that's the ending they get, like it's not just bad luck. Because as it is it feels like some kind of "Life sucks, people die and sometimes there's nothing you can do" thing, which just isn't cool. Sure, that's how it works in real life, but Improbable Island is the last place I expected to get a reminder of that.


 
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dizzyizzy
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 02:48 AM UTC  
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well, at first I was pretty enraged... I was at a point where I was just spamming through suicidal fights, didn't need any help, and she starts cutting my req payouts in half. I got her killed as fast as I possibly could. One of the things I see most often from rookies is complaints about a lack of req... cutting their payments in half probably isn't the way to help them with that.


 
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Paul Lo
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 03:29 AM UTC  
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She doesn't stick long enough to become a true bother, I say.

Quite an interesting event, a (small) sort of introduction to mercenaries perhaps? But then Some details would be needed for youngins' who go hire their first buddy, such as the no-half-req-loss part of the deal and such.


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Rosin
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 05:41 AM UTC  
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Hey hey! It wasn't sucky it wasn't boring and it didn't suck. At least, from my point of view. She took half my req from jungle fights, so? I mean, I nabbed the quest unknowingly after it'd been tweaked for her to self heal, and I've got kinda beasty stats for level two at current, so those blacksmith arms of hers were getting in solid 20 damage hits, but from a game standpoint it didn't really bother me at all. In fact, I liked having her there getting in an extra hit for me on the jungle beasties, it was useful while it lasted. Then again, I'm not really all that interested in req payouts.

From a story perspective, having it say that the character wasn't ex-military is.. Iffy? I mean, there are a lot of ex-mil people on the island. They tend to survive long enough for it to be considered nearly canon, as opposed to your average office worker who dies in the jungle and is never heard of again.

SPOILER MAYBE BELOW I DON'T KNOW


I LIKE HAVING ROSIN MAKE FRIENDS. ROBOT FRIEND WAS FUN, JILL FRIEND IS FUN. I would like to see more of them. (STRANGER WAS NOT FUN FRIEND, HOWEVER.)


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Buddleia
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 06:11 AM UTC  
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I don't think it sucked. It was fairly interesting and entertaining, and a nice reminder of the whole Island story. However, I wasn't in the position of a new player.

Lose half my req for fights? Yeah, sure, I've got full kit and 20k in the bank. Whatever. Most level two rookies won't.

Make sure she doesn't die? Keeping an eye on her hitpoints (hers were scaled to mine, so at 427 or so, I had some leeway) was easy for me; I usually keep my eyes on the right side of the screen anyway, looking to see how many rounds of plasgun I have left while I'm spamming the T button. Most rookies probably won't find it so easy to keep an eye on everything. Nearly all the comments I saw in Story and Banter were along the lines of "Oh whoops, my Jill died". So maybe it does need to be easier to keep her going. I approve of the free and automatic healing.

Another thing. Perhaps a reward at the end if she does survive? Like, you gain one charm from feeling awesome about yourself? Or at least, you get the effect of a coffee, since the flavour text says you're drinking one?

I would also like a little flavour text maybe a few gamedays later, where Jill, now looking fine, waves hi to you, or something.

(By the way, Nanobug: Timed Combat gives a bonus if you get it right, but there's no penalty if you don't or don't want to. Feel free to ignore it.)


Improbable Reference Links - goo.gl/MRBnb -------------- Land Registry (map of Places) ---- goo.gl/bpkRR
 
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Iriana
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 06:34 AM UTC  
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So far I haven't heard anything to suggest that declining a quest like Jill or the Stranger gives any result other than ending it--no one seems to decline, anyways!--but in the future, I was thinking that it might be interesting if after you said 'no' and walked away, it triggered an event some time in the future that resulted from your refusal. Not that I can think of any interesting form that these events could take, but.


 
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Harris
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 06:57 AM UTC  
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I LIKE it.

I got her in New Pitts, which made things feel a little off-kilter when the encounter said "another minute in NewHome", but other than that, golden!

SPOILER ALERT!!!








I hunted on Easy Fights only, had a Lightning Gun, and have fairly decent attack bonuses- and I barely had to heal her at all. I think maybe three times. She survived, and we parted on a high note after she got her req. quota.

The characterization of you the Narrator is nicely generic- still retaining the mentality of a Contestant at the same time. I assume the line about You not being ex-military was removed, and replaced with "you're religious"? If so, in the middle of an Improbable war, I think that actually works EXPONENTIALLY better.
"There are no atheists in foxholes" and such. Big Grin

From reading the responses in this thread before I actually encountered her, I gather too that the player could not see how close she was to her req. goal before?
I liked the fact that you could track her health AND her money. It added a little weight to the story and a lot to the strategy.
Oh, I LOVE the fact that she's the lady from the home page.

Right up there with Rohit, Ryu (was it it Ryu...? The Maiko's Pan dude!!), and yes, even the Stranger, I look very much forward to seeing Jill again. Even if it's ONLY more sidequests.
Tieing any (or all!) of our new sidequest buddies into a MAJOR storyline would be the bee's knees though, Mister Dan Sir!
WAIT...
Reunite us with Jill and Rohit AT THE SAME TIME. Please, please please!!!!!!!!!!

This 'un's a keeper Dan, please don't kill it!!


"Ain't nothin' left to do but smile, smile, smile." -The Grateful Dead
 
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Hairy Mary
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 10:44 AM UTC  
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Minor bug:


10 shiny Requisition tokens are dispensed from the nearest camera!
You hand 5 of the tokens to Jill.
Jill now has %s of the 110 tokens she needs for a basic weapon and armour.
Jill heads off into the Hospital Tent, and re-emerges a few minutes later with a fresh set of bandages and a determined expression.

Jill now has 77 of the 110 tokens she needs for a basic weapon and armour.



I'm told how much req she has twice, but the first time it just says %s instead of giving me a number.

And yes, I agree with Harris, it would be nice if after making these friends, we bumped into them again at some point.


 
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Kelwine
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 12:38 PM UTC  
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I liked the quest, and I was able to keep her alive! Though, the having her go after so short a time was sad, it was a happy kind of sad. I felt smiley and sappy being able to help. (Wish I could now find an actual Rookie to help out like that.)


 
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Twosocks Monkey
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 01:21 PM UTC  
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Personally I loved it, but was really disappointed when she was carted off to the failboat after only a few easy fights with me. I'm pretty low in the island ranking, only 5 DK's and trying for a Rank 6, so I had a bit against me I guess.

I tried to see if I could activate her return by going to the failboat/trying a new day and was sad I didn't get a second chance with her.

Otherwise I loved the companion fighter/plot point and think it's a good idea overall, just needs some tweaking. Maybe the suggestion of being able to defend her better could somehow be implemented...or you could find her on the failboat and try again?

Either way I usually love the canon plotlines, like the Maiko quest .

More more more more more of these please!

-Rose


moooooooooo Visit and help me finish the monster list: goo.gl/rpBGe (Ya'll mostly know me as CLOG, fyi)
 
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Anonymous: Escemfer
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 04:39 PM UTC  


I thought it was alright. It wasn't anything amazing, but it wasn't bad, either. I'll agree with the comments about cutting the req payout in half; it's not easy for rookies to get cash, and with their low stats, they need all they can get. One thing that struck me was the line at the end of each story segment, like "And what happens now?" It seems a bit too obviously leading, disrupting the flow a bit. But then again, for new players, this might not matter. It's probably a much better read if you are new, and aren't comparing it to some of the other storyline quests.

Quick question, though: This triggers directly on level-up for level 2 rookies, but so does the Watcher and her computer (if I'm remembering right). Will they both trigger appropriately, and if so, in what order? The unending pages of storyline might get annoying for some, and it could be jarring to have them come at you one right after the other. I'd suggest putting one or the other of those a level or two later in the game.

Unless I'm totally wrong about when the Watcher triggers, in which case, just ignore that. Mr. Green


 
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Count Sessine
 Wednesday, February 23 2011 @ 05:17 PM UTC  
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Quote by: Escemfer

I thought it was alright. It wasn't anything amazing, but it wasn't bad, either. I'll agree with the comments about cutting the req payout in half; it's not easy for rookies to get cash, and with their low stats, they need all they can get.

Actually, it's pretty easy for rookies to get enough cash to survive if they know about selling their free stuff at eBoy's. (I've shepherded several disposable RP alts through to at least 2nd level, and played a few of them a bit further. Roughly speaking, equipment costs are calibrated to jungle payouts, the free stuff pays for food. If you're willing to wait a game day or two at the beginning without eating, it's not hard to get ahead of the game and have enough equipment so you don't die.)

The Jill quest mentions that source of income right at the beginning, so if they read, think about what they read, and take the hint to try it -- new players may actually come out financially ahead for having met her.

I agree that the story needs a coda. If you get to like Jill, you want to know that she has adapted, with your help, and has settled in okay as a contestant.

It would be very cool if, the next time after the quest's over that you would have died in battle, she comes along and kills the monster, thus thanking you (by saving your life) and showing you that your help really did make a difference.


 
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