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 Cigs - what to do with them all?
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talkydoor
 Friday, May 14 2010 @ 09:22 PM UTC  
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Quote by: Awesome+Fred

Quote by: tehdave

Quote by: Geth

There really should be a way to transfer cigs. We can transfer req. We can transfer points. Why not cigs?



Game breakage.



I am against cig transfer, but I do say, Donor Points are transferable and usable to purchase cigs, and req transfer is in the game with a severe limit. As it currently stands, the answer "Game breakage" shouldn't be sufficient to properly defeat the idea of Cig Transfer.



Heehee. 'Congratulations on bruising the titan's left toenail, have 100 cigs! Don't use them all at once.'

You know I would...


 
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Cousjava
 Friday, May 14 2010 @ 09:38 PM UTC  
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Quote by: tehdave

Quote by: Geth

There really should be a way to transfer cigs. We can transfer req. We can transfer points. Why not cigs?



Game breakage.



1 cig/currentDKrank/gameday ?

Hardly very much now is it? Not game-breaking, surely - 7 cigs per day for someone on a R7 to someone else on a R7?


A table, a chair, a bowl of fruit and a trombone; what else does a man need to be happy?
 
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tehdave
 Friday, May 14 2010 @ 09:38 PM UTC  
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Quote by: talkydoor

Quote by: Awesome+Fred

Quote by: tehdave

Quote by: Geth

There really should be a way to transfer cigs. We can transfer req. We can transfer points. Why not cigs?



Game breakage.



I am against cig transfer, but I do say, Donor Points are transferable and usable to purchase cigs, and req transfer is in the game with a severe limit. As it currently stands, the answer "Game breakage" shouldn't be sufficient to properly defeat the idea of Cig Transfer.



Heehee. 'Congratulations on bruising the titan's left toenail, have 100 cigs! Don't use them all at once.'

You know I would...



Use them all at once? So'd I Mr. Green

But as far as why it would be game breaking, where DP transfer wouldn't be? Because DP transfer is unlimited, but you...oh, payed for it somehow, whether actual money or efforts promoting or improving the Island. Cigs you could have a character that can run rank 7s like nothing, where they can collect cigs easily, feeding a rookie (or really, any relatively low DK character) cigs, with no real cost to either, especially if said veteran is overflowing with them anyway.

Difference? DP you pay for, or it requires the same kind of effort, regardless of level, veteran status, number of DKs, etc.
Cigs are much easier for a veteran, high-DK character to earn. Same for Req, but there's a limit as to what Req can purchase.

Edit: re: Cousjava: yeah, but you could start a rank 7 and fail to drop back down to a low rank after a couple gamedays of cig transfers.


Isn't sanity just a one-trick pony anyway? All you get is one trick: rational thinking. But when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, the sky's the limit.
 
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Fergus
 Friday, May 14 2010 @ 10:06 PM UTC  
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I see cig transfer relating and turning into what happened in Season 1 with gifting. It was very easy to get loads of req just in the process of getting to level 15, and since there was nothing else to spend your money on it was customary to gift invisisuits to newbies. I remember tales that some people had been gifted every time they were level 1 after killing the drive until they were jokers, where they'd start the cycle again. While that's absolutely fantastic that we're all such a nice community, it was too much and the game wasn't a challenge or anything, so CMJ got rid of it.
There'd have to be a limit, but a limit makes this well... kinda useless like req transfer is. Why would you be giving cigs as a r7 to another r7? If the second person (the receiver) is already running r7's then they will shortly be as loaded with cigs as you are. It would instead, without a doubt, be abused as someone picks a rank 7 run to get the cigs, then drops back down to normal levels with The Watcher.
I just don't think cig transfer can be done in a way that makes it worthwhile but not exploitable.

If you're really in need of a cig sink, code one up in Improbable Labs. Make a game where you bet cigs and get a nice, shiny new iitem if you win, something worth using your cigs for.


 
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zamboni
 Saturday, May 15 2010 @ 12:33 AM UTC  
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Cig transfer is interesting, but what's the purpose? So people can buy jewellery? Tattoos? Backpacks? Building supplies?

There's nothing to buy with cigs that are game breaking (you have to have a certain number of DKs to get the good gear and anyone who's unlocked good gear can certainly earn enough ciggies on their own), so why would ciggy transfers be game breaking?

I'm neither for nor against ciggy transfers, unless allowing them would make it impossible to implement interesting stuff to buy with ciggies; if that's the case, then I'm against the transfers.


 
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Kash
 Saturday, May 15 2010 @ 04:55 AM UTC  
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Quote by: zamboni

I'm neither for nor against ciggy transfers, unless allowing them would make it impossible to implement interesting stuff to buy with ciggies; if that's the case, then I'm against the transfers.



I think that is my main concern with cig transfers: You're right, there's nothing really game-breaking about it, but I think it would take some of the rookies' fun out of earning them for themselves. When I first started playing, I was excited every time I had enough cigs for a new tattoo, and then when I realized that luggage would be much more useful, I started saving for that. Then dwellings came out and I saved up for a stake, meanwhile searching out the perfect plot for Kash's dugout and doing other planning for it.

While most players probably wouldn't beg for mass amounts of cigs from players that have surplus (and most experience players wouldn't give them out freely) I think even just knowing that cigs are something that you and only you can earn for yourself needs to be kept around. To make a completely exaggerated analogy, it would be like having a button at Deimos' that instantly gave you the biggest hat: Even if you could, why would you want to? It would take the only fun part out of hats.


 
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Hairy Mary
 Sunday, May 16 2010 @ 02:47 PM UTC  
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Quote by: Cousjava

Quote by: tehdave

Quote by: Geth

There really should be a way to transfer cigs. We can transfer req. We can transfer points. Why not cigs?



Game breakage.



1 cig/currentDKrank/gameday ?

Hardly very much now is it? Not game-breaking, surely - 7 cigs per day for someone on a R7 to someone else on a R7?



As I mentioned in another thread, some of my various different characters would quite like an easier flow of cigs. There was some quite significant opposition to anything of the sort. Five a day would be a massive increase for me (assuming that I could find someone to donate to the Skronky Benevolent Fund). It would mean that I'd no longer have to go jungle fighting and worrying about how to lose all that exp that gets thrown at you. So yes, I think that that would be close to game breaking.


 
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Count Sessine
 Sunday, May 16 2010 @ 04:05 PM UTC  
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Quote by: Hairy+Mary

Quote by: Cousjava

Quote by: tehdave

Quote by: Geth

There really should be a way to transfer cigs. We can transfer req. We can transfer points. Why not cigs?



Game breakage.



1 cig/currentDKrank/gameday ?

Hardly very much now is it? Not game-breaking, surely - 7 cigs per day for someone on a R7 to someone else on a R7?



As I mentioned in another thread, some of my various different characters would quite like an easier flow of cigs. There was some quite significant opposition to anything of the sort. Five a day would be a massive increase for me (assuming that I could find someone to donate to the Skronky Benevolent Fund). It would mean that I'd no longer have to go jungle fighting and worrying about how to lose all that exp that gets thrown at you. So yes, I think that that would be close to game breaking.

To put this in perspective... the Factory gives at most 4 cigs in a day -- if you're very very lucky -- and you're risking insta-death every time you go in.

Cigs are plentiful at R6 or R7. Giving them away would be painless. Much too easy.

DP transfer, on the other hand, is all right. Once you give points away, they're gone. Subtracted not only from your unspent total, but your total EVER, as if you never even had them. DPs are hard to earn, and there are more and more uses for them, so people have to think twice and three times before doing a transfer. It's never going to be something done on a regular basis. Special occasions only.


 
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Hairy Mary
 Sunday, May 16 2010 @ 07:59 PM UTC  
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With DP, it's the player that's earned them, not the character so to speak. When I donate, I do so through Alexander Quandle usually, then he farms the DP out to my other characters as I want them to go. AQ was the only character that I rated monsters in the jungle with, on the basis that CMJ didn't want the same person rating things three times. But then I shared the DP out amongst my folks as I saw fit.

I see DP as "pre-game" it's this side of the fourth wall, it only really "belongs" to a character when it's spent. This isn't much of a distinction when you've only got one character maybe, but still, it's quite different to req and cigs.


 
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Azhron
 Tuesday, May 18 2010 @ 02:47 AM UTC  
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Here's an idea:

there was talk of mobile dwellings in a previous thread, so why not make these cig powered, resulting in both a cig sink and another method of stamina free travel?

100 cigs (or any viable price)to make the dwelling ambulatory (or perhaps seafaring)

5 cigs (or any viable price) to move the dwelling one square in any direction, limited either to land or water.

...I suddenly have a vision of Dunbernarding marching across the Island, eclipsing the sun with its bulk


 
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tehdave
 Tuesday, May 18 2010 @ 08:57 AM UTC  
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Quote by: Azhron

Here's an idea:

there was talk of mobile dwellings in a previous thread, so why not make these cig powered, resulting in both a cig sink and another method of stamina free travel?

100 cigs (or any viable price)to make the dwelling ambulatory (or perhaps seafaring)

5 cigs (or any viable price) to move the dwelling one square in any direction, limited either to land or water.

...I suddenly have a vision of Dunbernarding marching across the Island, eclipsing the sun with its bulk



And you thought it was hard to navigate when stationary?

Imagine the confusion when the various outbuildings and wings start shifting about to form...

DUNBERNARDINGBOT!


Isn't sanity just a one-trick pony anyway? All you get is one trick: rational thinking. But when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, the sky's the limit.
 
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Cousjava
 Tuesday, May 18 2010 @ 07:28 PM UTC  
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See also: Howl's Moving Castle.

Don't think there's one on the island, but soon there will be Cousjava's Moving Castle. I want those cigs...


A table, a chair, a bowl of fruit and a trombone; what else does a man need to be happy?
 
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tehdave
 Tuesday, May 18 2010 @ 11:21 PM UTC  
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Quote by: Cousjava

See also: Howl's Moving Castle.



Yes, but snarkier.

And HUNGRY!

Bruce will be working overtime. Unpaid, of course.


Isn't sanity just a one-trick pony anyway? All you get is one trick: rational thinking. But when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, the sky's the limit.
 
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Reverb
 Wednesday, May 19 2010 @ 01:32 AM UTC  
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We'll have to build another dozen or so rooms for this.. a cockpit, a control tower, a rotating restaurant at the dome level...

Actually, we realy should be having that last one, with or without the ambulatory buildings..


"Censure acquits the Raven, but pursues the Dove." "So, that means i'm -always- innocent, right?"
 
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Xith
 Wednesday, May 19 2010 @ 01:41 AM UTC  
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We'll have to build another dozen or so rooms for this.. a cockpit, a control tower, a rotating restaurant at the dome level...

Actually, we realy should be having that last one, with or without the ambulatory buildings..


Don't forget an engine room.


 
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Fergus
 Wednesday, May 19 2010 @ 02:19 AM UTC  
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Quote by: Xith

We'll have to build another dozen or so rooms for this.. a cockpit, a control tower, a rotating restaurant at the dome level...

Actually, we realy should be having that last one, with or without the ambulatory buildings..


Don't forget an engine room.

The funny thing is, Dunbernarding already has one. Think of everything, they did.


 
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Bernard
 Wednesday, May 19 2010 @ 06:28 AM UTC  
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Quote by: Reverb

We'll have to build another dozen or so rooms for this.. a cockpit, a control tower, a rotating restaurant at the dome level...

Actually, we realy should be having that last one, with or without the ambulatory buildings..



Noted.


 
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Aeridus
 Friday, July 02 2010 @ 04:07 AM UTC  
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I'd just be happy with a tent that could be fed cigs to be upgraded over time, as someone else mentioned. Big Grin I do hope tents are still on the agenda.


 
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Zolotisty
 Friday, July 02 2010 @ 05:19 AM UTC  
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Tents are indeed still on the agenda -- when they'll happen is unclear, but we get a new NPC when they launch. She's awesome. Wink

For those who want mobile dwellings... just take my word on it and be patient; don't pretend you can do it with a Dwelling right now. Mr. Green


BARK BARK BARK.
 
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Adder Moray
 Friday, July 02 2010 @ 06:57 AM UTC  
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Quote by: Derander

Roughly 20 weeks should do it, going by personal experience.

But I don't really see a problem with the system as it is. I stopped speedrunning with 1200 ciggies in the bank and am down to 900 in a week due to titans suddenly appearing everywhere and an extensive building project. And using them for that felt way more rewarding than buying yet another expensive piece of jewelry.

But if you're really piling up the ciggs beyond that, why not search for some fun/worthy/struggling/whatever little clan, join them and put heaps in their bank? That'll do more for your fame than a little statue somewhere... is what I was planning to do.

Or, for a real challenge... don't just join someone else's clan -- start your own, and discover a whole new world of complexity. Mr. Green



Hear hear!


 
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