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 I broke the game with Titans
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Tamar
 Monday, February 09 2015 @ 05:28 PM UTC (Read 5869 times)  
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Currently there is a swarm of 3.2 billion HP Titans such as, http://tinyurl.com/l5rqxw7. After a day of observation it appears the Titans aren't getting smaller which makes me believe that my hypothesis is true and that the older titans must be killed to lower the spawn rate and HP. Now, if this is an actual problem I suggest two changes:

1. Have Titans decay over time regardless of if they are killed.
2. Create a "Spirit of Cooperation" buff that gets exponentially more powerful the more players are fighting it.


 
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kireikatt
 Monday, February 09 2015 @ 09:13 PM UTC  
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I'd like to see a cap put on max titan HP, and a limit imposed on overclocking, myself. I do like the spirit of cooperation idea, though!


 
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Wongo the Sane
 Tuesday, February 10 2015 @ 09:26 AM UTC  
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I'm standing on Cyber City, and I can see 25 titans. Three are on the Cyber City square.

Sounds like it'll take nearly forever to dig ourselves out of this one...


 
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Jon Bishop
 Tuesday, February 10 2015 @ 08:48 PM UTC  
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At the risk of sounding a little harsh I'd like to put in my two cents, here:

Why? I get that its fun to mess around with, but intentionally making this happen makes everything a mess. We can argue that the outposts are fine without walls because breaching has to do with threat levels, but there's really more to it than that. If I was new to the island and saw the clutter of titans across every step of the map I'd have second thoughts about continuing to play. It makes aspects of the game just look broken.

I'm confused at what this 'test' is accomplishing other than proving you have the power to do it.


 
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Lea.wolfsfeld
 Tuesday, February 10 2015 @ 11:21 PM UTC  
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In all honesty it has proven one thing.

The titans can spiral out of control. Which I hope that now that it was proven that players can push the titans that high it means that something will be done to stop the titans from getting so bad again. OK yeah, I can see the benefit of bumping up the titan's numbers (the req payout) but when the titan's hp inflates past 3.5 billion, most folks including the DK munching bastards don't really stand a snowball's chance with them.

The biggest issue I see with the titans are their HP. When it gets high no one wants to tackle them. So maybe max them out at a high but reasonable number. And to encourage more people to try and hunt them (even if they're not the one to kill them) maybe there could be a multiplier for each titan you're involved in the killing of.


 
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Tamar
 Wednesday, February 11 2015 @ 12:06 AM UTC  
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When I started, I didn't really have a set plan in mind. I just wanted to see what would happen. I did gain some insight on how Titans work and it's Day #2 and nothing bad has happened yet. Not a single outpost as been breached from lack of walls and a high monster count yet.


 
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Docenspiel
 Wednesday, February 11 2015 @ 02:43 AM UTC  
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Or, here's a thought, have the only person able to bring the Titans to unreasonable levels stop bringing the Titans to unreasonable levels.


For rent: one skull, in serious need of dusting.
 
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Omega
 Wednesday, February 11 2015 @ 03:39 AM UTC  
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Pretty much anybody with over ten drivekills can bring Titans to that level alone, though.


There are two secrets to success. The second one is to never reveal all your secrets.
 
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Saber
 Wednesday, February 11 2015 @ 05:06 AM UTC  
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Some thoughts, not necessarily in any order.

3.2 Billion. I didn't think I'd ever see it that high. Good show.

I think that if I were a new player, I'd see that HP and presume II has some sort of endgame beyond DKs becoming progressively harder or the occasional unlock, and that it'd actually hook me instead of turn me away. I'd also be more interested in learning the mechanics behind what goes on, and it might get me interested in that stuff so that by the time the silly descriptions wear thin that I've got another gameplay reason to stick around. The mass of Titans makes the game look crazy, and considering the setting I don't think that's such a bad thing.

I do take issue with the implication that any of this means Titans are broken. They've increased in HP as a response to how quickly players kill them, and there have been past instances of this same thing occurring, though not at the same magnitude. This isn't a new feature by any means, and considering the dropoff in the frequency of Titan deaths, it's an issue that self-corrects. Moreover, as has been alluded, anyone with more than ten DKs can theoretically take Titans up to that level of HP, provided they've the time and initiative.

As I see it, the only groups actually impacted in any meaningful way are:

People doing high level DKs who prefer lower HP Titans so that they can get a req payout at the start of level one.

People who prefer low HP Titans for the easy req payout.

People who like seeing wall HP really high.

People who must navigate the worldmap through text-to-speech methods, and thus might become irritated by the constant Titan message spam.

People with averse reactions to fun.

That's it. Not a single outpost has breached yet, and if it does it'll be met with excitement from some who actually enjoy breaches due to the ease of leveling and the rarity of the event. Laugh. Screencap. Maybe turn it into RP or get a posse together to utilize the otherwise-neglected feature of groupfighting the things. This doesn't need to be something that needs action taken from a developer standpoint.


 
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Jon Bishop
 Wednesday, February 11 2015 @ 05:37 AM UTC  
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I can't exactly agree with that, Saber. It absolutely can take away from fun if most players can't contribute anything meaningful to the fight. When the titans are at that high of an HP, lower players can wail on them all day but still get nearly no payout for it. When one of these titans fell, I got a reck payout of zero. The system itself worked fine, but then then the players that were able to get the hp that high in the first place actively decided to stop fighting, forcing all new titans to spawn at that level. With that in mind, you've got a select few players who have all the power in the scenario, able to decide if and when they want titans that are nearly unkillable for everyone else to go away. The impact on outposts isn't really the point. It's practically making a game feature useless to everyone but a select few. Fun for them, yes. Fun for everyone else? Not really.


 
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Saber
 Wednesday, February 11 2015 @ 06:01 AM UTC  
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Any individual with access to Robots and Gargleblasters can arbitrarily decide to take Titan HP that high. Likewise, they can also decide to take chunks out of the ones currently roaming the map. Spawnrates will go down as the amount of Titans being killed drops, and it'll normalize. I don't see a newer player so on the edge of staying or leaving that the current situation makes them choose to quit. Though, I can envision a scenario where established players find it inconvenient enough to post about.


 
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Jon Bishop
 Wednesday, February 11 2015 @ 07:26 AM UTC  
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Let me start by apologizing for any hostility I may have shown towards anyone in my previous posts here. It wasn't really my intention, you're all great. Since I figure I'm the established player in question, I won't speculate further on what a new player would do.

The necessity for Gargleblasters and being a robot creates a problem. It forces players into being a certain race in order to do anything about it, and requires the player has a decent surplus of reck as it is. That's pretty limiting, and there's not quite enough of that going around to normalize everything.


 
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Tamar
 Wednesday, February 11 2015 @ 07:10 PM UTC  
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Well, to be fair, Overclocking is the main good thing about the robot race since they can't eat.

Anyways, I don't think a lot of changes need to be made. In the four years I have been here this is the first time Titans have gotten this big. Going by the Nightmare Enthusiast HoF rankings, only a handful of people would be capable of getting Titans to Billions of HP. Having a cap on Titan HP and have the Titan spawn rate and HP decrease over time should be sufficient.


 
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JonT
 Friday, February 13 2015 @ 11:10 PM UTC  
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Honestly, I didn't have a problem with them, I thought it was fun. Maybe the cap could be useful but that's really not necessary unless people decide to experiment again. But even so I believe that it's a rare enough occurence that's not really necessary. As for the spirit of cooperation buff idea. I love it. It's something that will allow modest little guys like myself to be able to fight titans effectively. If you get 10 or so noobs that actually want to fight them then you should be able to take them down without robot or gargles.


 
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Count Sessine
 Saturday, February 14 2015 @ 02:59 AM UTC  
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I had an idea that's probably worth recording here. What if the cooperation buff could be either positive or negative!

Why, you may ask, would anyone want a debuff when fighting a titan with others? Well, it has to do with the disparity in power. When you are able to swat a titan with a single blow and this happens automatically whenever you engage, that means you can't fight alongside anyone. As soon as you join the fight, it's bloody over. That's disappointing for everyone else, but it's also lonely for you -- you don't ever get to be part of a team.

Conceptually it would be an averaging for everyone who's in the fight. The powerhouse players would be (Improbably!) lending some of their strength to the newcomers who join them. It would address the two big problems with Titans at once! Game balance would be a bit tricky -- have to make sure a Tamar joining the fight doesn't make everyone so strong that the fight is still over in a single round.

But caps could handle that. And a cooperation buff would be so much fun!


One potential downside: I can see there being a performance issue caused by recalculating buffs on the fly as people enter and leave a fight. Still, CMJ is a wizard at performance tuning -- perhaps this problem is solvable.


 
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Harris
 Monday, February 16 2015 @ 02:46 AM UTC  
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I stopped caring about Titans after the threat of Onslaught was removed. Never was much into min/maxing in any game I play- not even things like D&D or Fallout.

Now, when Onslaught was a threat? Holy balls was that exciting, and so were the Titans!

My priority #1 with videogame action is "Is it fun?" The rest is just details.

I think I'll go fight my own tongue. Mr. Green


"Ain't nothin' left to do but smile, smile, smile." -The Grateful Dead
 
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Hairy Mary
 Monday, February 16 2015 @ 01:04 PM UTC  
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I'm not convinced that anything needs to be done to 'fix' titans. Somebody pushed them way up, and then knocked them down again. I think that we can handle that happening every five years or so.

As for the Spirit of Cooperation buff. I can see why this would be attractive - encouraging groups to work together. On the other hand, I'm a bit wary of this. Titans, as they are, seem to me to be by far the most interesting part of the game for hardened game players. Strategies are discussed, involving the use of various parts of the Island and people have written large G-docs on the subject. That's several levels of complexity beyond jungle fighting. Gamers, have I got this right? If so, then titans play a rather important role, and I'd be careful about messing about with that.


 
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